Wanted to share my experience here about our return and how it has been for us since then. It has been a while since return so I dont remember all the details. However, I do remember why we came back and with what. Not many will relate to my situation and story but the intention is to let know that you can make things happen in India too. Coming back to India doesnt mean end of the world.
At the outset let me make it very clear that I do not dislike (forget hating) US in any way, shape or form. I disagree with some of the things that the US politicians do or some US policies but I agree wholeheartedly that US is the best country in the world currently. Has been that way and will be that way in the near foreseeable future. So anything that I say negative about US should be seen in the context.
As to India, I have very mixed feelings. I feel it is a great place to live. At other times I think it isnt so great. Even when I feel it is a great place, I do that knowing very well that it has a lot of catching up to do with the rest of the world. So you may see some views that might pose as India is a superlative place but that's a fleeting feeling of one family at a given time. Not to be confused as a sole, broad and unquestionable view. But you have to see that I live in India and I like it here, so my views about India will be tainted accordingly, doesnt mean I am withdrawn from reality.
Finally this is not an attempt to convince anyone to R2I or otherwise. But I believe that if I could come back and live a close to decent life, I think anybody else can too. I see a lot of people with unnecessary doubts and some sort of fear of the unknown. Hope my experience will make them get only one step (of numerous steps) closer to their decision - R2I or LIA.
R2I to Mumbai and Our LII experiences
R2I to Mumbai and Our LII experiences
Good to see you back in this forum. You have the freedom to like or hate any country of this world and USA is no exception. This is true regardless of where you choose to live.Millions of people immigrate and want to immigrate to US. That should tell something about the country. Personally after R2I and R2A I feel convinced given pros/cons USA fares better. I do miss India sometimes and get nostalgic once in a while. But IMO to some extent life is what you make of it and where you can be happy. This is a pro-R2I forum and you should feel free to highlight the pros of living a life in India and let those on the fence decide for themselves.
R2I to Mumbai and Our LII experiences
desi4ever;659435Good to see you back in this forum. You have the freedom to like or hate any country of this world and USA is no exception. This is true regardless of where you choose to live.Millions of people immigrate and want to immigrate to US. That should tell something about the country. Personally after R2I and R2A I feel convinced given pros/cons USA fares better. I do miss India sometimes and get nostalgic once in a while. But IMO to some extent life is what you make of it and where you can be happy. This is a pro-R2I forum and you should feel free to highlight the pros of living a life in India and let those on the fence decide for themselves.
Absolutely! Everyone is different. Many people fall in the mainstream who like US and prefer it over India. A large desi population would immigrate to US in a jiffy. But there are exceptions. I did not think that I will not adjust to US:) But I couldnt. Many a times our own expectations from life change and then there are kids, spouse, parents, etc..who dictate priorities at different times.
R2I to Mumbai and Our LII experiences
We returned to India after 10 yrs in US. Went in early 90s on F1 and returned in early 2000s. My specific goal in US was to earn a doctorate and once that was done my personal goal was attained. Then stayed on for some more years to get some work experience (non-IT) which actually helped me a lot after returning to India.
Why we came back?
I had a decent job with average salary after I graduated. The work was satisfying too. Have siblings in India to take care of parents, so no urgency from that angle either. There were no visa issues either. Did not apply for GC and so no frustration of the wait. I used to visit India quite often and just like everyone else used to feel bad when it came to returning to US. Used to feel nostalgic and homesick after going back to US for a few weeks and then life would become normal again.
One thing that was very clear in my mind was that I will not settle in US. And this feeling I had even before I left for US. Also, I had a clear cut goal to achieve - PhD. Once that was done and since I did not have any plans to settle, I started to think how long can I stay there only for money. Life there was good, no complaints. But bottomline was that I was staying there only for money. I wasnt particularly fascinated by anything else about America except that it offered a lot of material comforts. I did not really run away from India or its problems when I went to US. I actually went there with a goal and the kind of facilities available there to achieve that goal. Plus it was "the" thing to do in 90s. It elevated one's stature in society. But life wasnt bad for me in India. So I did not get into the loop of comparison between India and US to feel that I lived in a better society.
Right from F1 days I could never understand how we can keep moving from one goal to another like getting H1B, GC, USC; single family home to mansions; camry to lexus; etc. My friends (I had plenty) used to discuss about such things and I never found it interesting. Also, I realised that we used to stick amongst ourselves. Social life felt restricted. Considering all this I felt like I was never wired to live in US. I appreciated the good things there but never felt like I cannot live without them. Plus like I said I was not running away from India either. I was aware of the issues in India and I was OK to live with them. In US people plan a lot to live and I could not do that. I am among those who just let life happen which was a great strength for me.
And then I got married and had kids. I had observed that most people, who would prefer R2I, were forced to settle down in US once their kids go into teens. That was another turning point. I wondered that with parents getting older, there is only X number of years left for them to spend with grandkids. That added to our decision.
To summarize I would say following played a role in my R2I:
1) Getting my PhD and realising that I am not wired for US life
2) Kids age - wanted to return before they grew old enough to have an opinion:)
3) Dreaded that I wont be around if something were to happen to parents
Of all the above I would give about 70% weightage to the first one and rest to the other two.
However, even with all the reasons for not conitnuing to live in US I think the fact that I never really disliked living in India played a great part. I know all the deficiencies in Indian society and the risks, but I never disliked being here.
And above all, I got cent percent support from wife (kids were quite young, so no opinion from them). Even the smallest hesitancy, after I explained it to her, would have not made it possible. My parents did not object. One of them was not wholeheartedly for the decision while the other was ecstatic. Siblings felt I was making a wrong decision but they said OK. Did not bounce that idea off anyone else. Just did it and I am extremely happy for it.
Will continue..how others reacted after we came back; what actually gave me the courage to give up earning USD in US; how much is enough; etc. etc.
Why we came back?
I had a decent job with average salary after I graduated. The work was satisfying too. Have siblings in India to take care of parents, so no urgency from that angle either. There were no visa issues either. Did not apply for GC and so no frustration of the wait. I used to visit India quite often and just like everyone else used to feel bad when it came to returning to US. Used to feel nostalgic and homesick after going back to US for a few weeks and then life would become normal again.
One thing that was very clear in my mind was that I will not settle in US. And this feeling I had even before I left for US. Also, I had a clear cut goal to achieve - PhD. Once that was done and since I did not have any plans to settle, I started to think how long can I stay there only for money. Life there was good, no complaints. But bottomline was that I was staying there only for money. I wasnt particularly fascinated by anything else about America except that it offered a lot of material comforts. I did not really run away from India or its problems when I went to US. I actually went there with a goal and the kind of facilities available there to achieve that goal. Plus it was "the" thing to do in 90s. It elevated one's stature in society. But life wasnt bad for me in India. So I did not get into the loop of comparison between India and US to feel that I lived in a better society.
Right from F1 days I could never understand how we can keep moving from one goal to another like getting H1B, GC, USC; single family home to mansions; camry to lexus; etc. My friends (I had plenty) used to discuss about such things and I never found it interesting. Also, I realised that we used to stick amongst ourselves. Social life felt restricted. Considering all this I felt like I was never wired to live in US. I appreciated the good things there but never felt like I cannot live without them. Plus like I said I was not running away from India either. I was aware of the issues in India and I was OK to live with them. In US people plan a lot to live and I could not do that. I am among those who just let life happen which was a great strength for me.
And then I got married and had kids. I had observed that most people, who would prefer R2I, were forced to settle down in US once their kids go into teens. That was another turning point. I wondered that with parents getting older, there is only X number of years left for them to spend with grandkids. That added to our decision.
To summarize I would say following played a role in my R2I:
1) Getting my PhD and realising that I am not wired for US life
2) Kids age - wanted to return before they grew old enough to have an opinion:)
3) Dreaded that I wont be around if something were to happen to parents
Of all the above I would give about 70% weightage to the first one and rest to the other two.
However, even with all the reasons for not conitnuing to live in US I think the fact that I never really disliked living in India played a great part. I know all the deficiencies in Indian society and the risks, but I never disliked being here.
And above all, I got cent percent support from wife (kids were quite young, so no opinion from them). Even the smallest hesitancy, after I explained it to her, would have not made it possible. My parents did not object. One of them was not wholeheartedly for the decision while the other was ecstatic. Siblings felt I was making a wrong decision but they said OK. Did not bounce that idea off anyone else. Just did it and I am extremely happy for it.
Will continue..how others reacted after we came back; what actually gave me the courage to give up earning USD in US; how much is enough; etc. etc.
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R2MyOldWorld
- Posts: 902
- Joined: Sat Feb 04, 2012 10:27 pm
R2I to Mumbai and Our LII experiences
Good to see you back. Keep writing. Stay away from political threads :p
R2I to Mumbai and Our LII experiences
[QUOTE]...Keep writing. Stay away from political threads :p
Agreed! Its an interesting read!
Agreed! Its an interesting read!
R2I to Mumbai and Our LII experiences
Welcome back, Vapasi1. Thanks for sharing your journey. Keep these gems coming!
R2I to Mumbai and Our LII experiences
Preparing to Return
In US
Our decision to return was made a long time back, the only question was the timing. It could have been a couple of years here or there, not a big window really. In terms of money (which wasnt really important or critical) it was a question of a few more lakhs. And the timing was decided impulsively. We were toying with the idea of an India vist and decided that it would be our final trip back home. We said to ourselves that now is as good as any other time. When I look back, that was quite unbelievable of us.
In terms of residence, we always rented which was a good decision. It was also a result of our not-so-strong finances at the time. I had just graduated and worked only a few years and our family had grown. Not much savings. With R2I firm in our mind we had opted to rent. So just a notice to the apartment complex was good enough.
In terms of household stuff, we donated all of it that was useful and threw a lot of stuff that I had from student days. Just packed a few favorite toys of kids in a suitcase. Of our daily use stuff carried as little as possible. Shopped for gifts for family and friends like we normally did during India visit and that formed the bulk of our luggage. We came back with 4 bags I think. No shipping, nothing.
Had only one car that I had bought just a year back. Transfered the title to a good friends name and asked him to sell it for a decent price.
In India
We were returning to our hometown to the place where I grew up. So no hassles there. Just came back and lived with the family in our old house.
Kids were too young, so nothing to worry about schools etc..
That's pretty much what I remember of our prep to come back.
In US
Our decision to return was made a long time back, the only question was the timing. It could have been a couple of years here or there, not a big window really. In terms of money (which wasnt really important or critical) it was a question of a few more lakhs. And the timing was decided impulsively. We were toying with the idea of an India vist and decided that it would be our final trip back home. We said to ourselves that now is as good as any other time. When I look back, that was quite unbelievable of us.
In terms of residence, we always rented which was a good decision. It was also a result of our not-so-strong finances at the time. I had just graduated and worked only a few years and our family had grown. Not much savings. With R2I firm in our mind we had opted to rent. So just a notice to the apartment complex was good enough.
In terms of household stuff, we donated all of it that was useful and threw a lot of stuff that I had from student days. Just packed a few favorite toys of kids in a suitcase. Of our daily use stuff carried as little as possible. Shopped for gifts for family and friends like we normally did during India visit and that formed the bulk of our luggage. We came back with 4 bags I think. No shipping, nothing.
Had only one car that I had bought just a year back. Transfered the title to a good friends name and asked him to sell it for a decent price.
In India
We were returning to our hometown to the place where I grew up. So no hassles there. Just came back and lived with the family in our old house.
Kids were too young, so nothing to worry about schools etc..
That's pretty much what I remember of our prep to come back.
R2I to Mumbai and Our LII experiences
Finances
As to finances, there is very little to write about. My net worth wasnt really anything to talk about. Didnt have a whole lot of money. I had saved a bit during student days that lay in FDs in India. After getting a job there, I had purchased a site and fiananced it thorugh my savings from the job. Had regularly been sending some portion of my savings to India. All I had in US banks was what I would need in an emergency. Apart from that I had some retirement accounts which I promptly closed after deciding to come back.
In all, my net worth when I returned was a grand total of about 100k USD including all the FDs in the Indian banks, the liquidated retirement accounts and the site value. I know it isnt much. People wouldnt leave a stable job and good savings potential when their net worth is 100k:) But I was OK with it.
My confidence about returning with such weak finances stemmed from the fact that I believed that I am good enough in a specialized field to make money in India too. I was confident of getting a good job. I had checked the Indian market just after my graduation and the salaries offered then were like Rs 30k/month. Few years later people in my field were earning close to Rs 75k/month. Around the time I returned, expenses were in the range of 20-30k per month for a general middle class living. That told me that salaries were rising and if we market ourselves with confidence we can get a good salary and keep growing.
Another idea I was toying with was becoming an entrepreneur after returning. I did not have the money to invest but I had the all-important expertise and idea to execute.
As to a job, I did not bother to wait until I get one. I had preliminary discussions with HLL and LnT in the 2-3 months prior to making the decision and they were offering me about 3 year old salaries. Their logic was that they will revise to current levels after I become a permanant employee in 6 months. I did not want to do that. I was sure the job market was buzzing and gettign a job for someone is not tough. And when I am in front of the hiring guy who wants my skills, I can bargain very hard.
Based on all the dilemma discussions here my return seems very unusual to me. Had no great net worth to talk about and no job either. Just qualifications, experience and the confidence. That's why I said that if I could do it, others can too who usually have much higher networth and are better planners. Of course, I did not have many trappings as I had worked only some time. For someone who has worked for a long duration, settled by buying a house, etc it would be much more difficult to wrap up. But I wouldnt know how difficult:)
As to finances, there is very little to write about. My net worth wasnt really anything to talk about. Didnt have a whole lot of money. I had saved a bit during student days that lay in FDs in India. After getting a job there, I had purchased a site and fiananced it thorugh my savings from the job. Had regularly been sending some portion of my savings to India. All I had in US banks was what I would need in an emergency. Apart from that I had some retirement accounts which I promptly closed after deciding to come back.
In all, my net worth when I returned was a grand total of about 100k USD including all the FDs in the Indian banks, the liquidated retirement accounts and the site value. I know it isnt much. People wouldnt leave a stable job and good savings potential when their net worth is 100k:) But I was OK with it.
My confidence about returning with such weak finances stemmed from the fact that I believed that I am good enough in a specialized field to make money in India too. I was confident of getting a good job. I had checked the Indian market just after my graduation and the salaries offered then were like Rs 30k/month. Few years later people in my field were earning close to Rs 75k/month. Around the time I returned, expenses were in the range of 20-30k per month for a general middle class living. That told me that salaries were rising and if we market ourselves with confidence we can get a good salary and keep growing.
Another idea I was toying with was becoming an entrepreneur after returning. I did not have the money to invest but I had the all-important expertise and idea to execute.
As to a job, I did not bother to wait until I get one. I had preliminary discussions with HLL and LnT in the 2-3 months prior to making the decision and they were offering me about 3 year old salaries. Their logic was that they will revise to current levels after I become a permanant employee in 6 months. I did not want to do that. I was sure the job market was buzzing and gettign a job for someone is not tough. And when I am in front of the hiring guy who wants my skills, I can bargain very hard.
Based on all the dilemma discussions here my return seems very unusual to me. Had no great net worth to talk about and no job either. Just qualifications, experience and the confidence. That's why I said that if I could do it, others can too who usually have much higher networth and are better planners. Of course, I did not have many trappings as I had worked only some time. For someone who has worked for a long duration, settled by buying a house, etc it would be much more difficult to wrap up. But I wouldnt know how difficult:)
R2I to Mumbai and Our LII experiences
Vapasi, I like your attitude towards life. Like you said what worked in your favor was the firm decision of returning to India without heavy emphasis on finances. That "How much is enough" thread although is important to some extent I find the title of the thread funny. You have done R2I in a simple and elegant manner.