r2i forum

- Pakistan is officially a US ally on the war on Terror.

- Obama administration approves billions in aid for Pakistan including weapons (to be used against who?)

- Hillary and team hold strategic meet with Kayani and team.

- Pakistan starting to openly snubs India and turning belligerent by the day.

- Zero progress on on 26/11 culprits.

- Attacks on Indians increase in Afganistan.

Its started to appear that while 26/11 has been relegated to history, US is more reliant on Pakistan and is turning a blind eye to terrorism against India. Also I cannot help but notice that our spokesmen/spokeswomen are quite weak and meek when it comes to talking on Pakistan.The Foreign office spokeswomen seems to have a fixed smile on her face and I don't hear anything definitive in her talks.

Has Pakistan gained leverage against India in the past few months, has our govt. literally been asleep?

Lets not forget that Pakistan army has already been modernised a lot under Musharaff and new goodies to Pakistan are going to end up against India only.

This thread never took off.

Yesterday was a watershed day with the leak of 1000s of classified docs from Afghan war by WikiLeaks.Org. Was reading the following from NYT and am wondering if the Pakistani ISI is really this ghost organization that can't be pinned down even by the mighty US for their actions.

Pakistan Aids Insurgency in Afghanistan, Reports Assert -> http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/26/world/asia/26isi.html?_r=1
[quote]Some of the reports describe Pakistani intelligence working alongside Al Qaeda to plan attacks. Experts cautioned that although Pakistan?s militant groups and Al Qaeda work together, directly linking the Pakistani spy agency, the Directorate for Inter-Services Intelligence, or ISI, with Al Qaeda is difficult.

The records also contain firsthand accounts of American anger at Pakistan?s unwillingness to confront insurgents who launched attacks near Pakistani border posts, moved openly by the truckload across the frontier, and retreated to Pakistani territory for safety.

The behind-the-scenes frustrations of soldiers on the ground and glimpses of what appear to be Pakistani skullduggery contrast sharply with the frequently rosy public pronouncements of Pakistan as an ally by American officials, looking to sustain a drone campaign over parts of Pakistani territory to strike at Qaeda havens. Administration officials also want to keep nuclear-armed Pakistan on their side to safeguard NATO supplies flowing on routes that cross Pakistan to Afghanistan.

This month, Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton, in one of the frequent visits by American officials to Islamabad, announced $500 million in assistance and called the United States and Pakistan ?partners joined in common cause.?

The reports suggest, however, that the Pakistani military has acted as both ally and enemy, as its spy agency runs what American officials have long suspected is a double game ? appeasing certain American demands for cooperation while angling to exert influence in Afghanistan through many of the same insurgent networks that the Americans are fighting to eliminate.

Behind the scenes, both Bush and Obama administration officials as well as top American commanders have confronted top Pakistani military officers with accusations of ISI complicity in attacks in Afghanistan, and even presented top Pakistani officials with lists of ISI and military operatives believed to be working with militants.[/quote]
[quote]Nonetheless, senior lawmakers say they have no doubt that Pakistan is aiding insurgent groups. ?The burden of proof is on the government of Pakistan and the ISI to show they don?t have ongoing contacts,? said Senator Jack Reed, a Rhode Island Democrat on the Armed Services Committee who visited Pakistan this month and said he and Senator Carl Levin of Michigan, the committee chairman, confronted Pakistan?s prime minister, Yousaf Raza Gilani, yet again over the allegations.

Such accusations are usually met with angry denials, particularly by the Pakistani military, which insists that the ISI severed its remaining ties to the groups years ago. An ISI spokesman in Islamabad said Sunday that the agency would have no comment until it saw the documents. Pakistan?s ambassador to the United States, Husain Haqqani, said, ?The documents circulated by WikiLeaks do not reflect the current on-ground realities.?[/quote]
Haven't we heard that before? :)


Will take a while to read the leaked docs (equivalent to the Pentagon Papers of the Vietnam War).

Reference Sites:
http://www.wikileaks.org/

WikiLeaks' "war logs" are online.
NYT: http://nyti.ms/dacIql
Guardian: http://bit.ly/dlNzWx
Der Spiegel: http://bit.ly/bpjIZk

Speigel Online: The Secret Enemy in Pakistan
[quote]The Directorate for Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI), Pakistan's secret service, originally helped to build up and deploy the Taliban after Afghanistan descended into a bitter and fratricidal civil war between the mujahedeen who had prevailed over the Soviets and forced their withdrawal. Despite all of the reassurances from Pakistani politicians that the old ties are cut, the country is still pursuing an ambiguous policy in the region -- at once serving as both an ally to the US and as a helper to its enemy.

There is plenty of new evidence to support this thesis. The documents clearly show that the Pakistani intelligence agency is the most important accomplice the Taliban has outside of Afghanistan. The war against the Afghan security forces, the Americans and their ISAF allies is still being conducted from Pakistan.[/quote]
[quote]According to the war logs, the ISI envoys are present when insurgent commanders hold war councils -- and even give specific orders to carry out murders. These include orders to try to assassinate Afghan President Hamid Karzai. For example, a threat report dated August 21, 2008 warned: "Colonel Mohammad Yusuf from the ISI had directed Taliban official Maulawi Izzatullah to see that Karzai was assassinated."[/quote]
Damning, indeed! Hope the Indians are reading the reports and calling the Senators in the US who don't support the Pakistanis much (Senator Jack Reed and Senator Carl Levin) to act now.

Now, why wouldn't Indian media print: "Pak Envoy to the US calls US Soldiers Liars and Rumor Mongers!"? :)

Pakistani envoy rejects Wikileaks Afghan war information -> http://thecable.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2010/07/25/pakistani_envoy_rejects_wikileaks_afghan_war_information
[quote]"These reports reflect nothing more than single-source comments and rumors, which abound on both sides of the Pakistan-Afghanistan border and are often proved wrong after deeper examination," Pakistan's Ambassador to the United States Husain Haqqani said in a statement.[/quote]

Tandoori;269077- Pakistan is officially a US ally on the war on Terror.

- Obama administration approves billions in aid for Pakistan including weapons (to be used against who?)

- Hillary and team hold strategic meet with Kayani and team.

- Pakistan starting to openly snubs India and turning belligerent by the day.

- Zero progress on on 26/11 culprits.

- Attacks on Indians increase in Afganistan.

Its started to appear that while 26/11 has been relegated to history, US is more reliant on Pakistan and is turning a blind eye to terrorism against India. Also I cannot help but notice that our spokesmen/spokeswomen are quite weak and meek when it comes to talking on Pakistan.The Foreign office spokeswomen seems to have a fixed smile on her face and I don't hear anything definitive in her talks.

Has Pakistan gained leverage against India in the past few months, has our govt. literally been asleep?

Lets not forget that Pakistan army has already been modernised a lot under Musharaff and new goodies to Pakistan are going to end up against India only.

Do not forget, for all the PR and US-Paki bhai-bhai, they are waging a war on Paki territory.
Would not want that for India.

boca2blr;309504Now, why wouldn't Indian media print: "Pak Envoy to the US calls US Soldiers Liars and Rumor Mongers!"? :)

Because that does not sell. Please talk about the richness of food that is given to Kasab.

boca2blr;309493Speigel Online: The Secret Enemy in Pakistan


Damning, indeed! Hope the Indians are reading the reports and calling the Senators in the US who don't support the Pakistanis much (Senator Jack Reed and Senator Carl Levin) to act now.

These Pakistanis are better off engaged on the other side of the border. Lesser havoc for Indians.

boca2blr;309504Now, why wouldn't Indian media print: "Pak Envoy to the US calls US Soldiers Liars and Rumor Mongers!"? :)

Pakistani envoy rejects Wikileaks Afghan war information -> http://thecable.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2010/07/25/pakistani_envoy_rejects_wikileaks_afghan_war_information

They are just taking advantage of the fact that the WMDs have still not been found in Iraq. Or is that another project blue book.

returning_indian;309576Because that does not sell. Please talk about the richness of food that is given to Kasab.

Are you so naive to believe whatever they say in the media?? If media says he's getting mutton biryani do you actually believe it given the maturity and professional levels of our media? come on!