Help needed to make R2A decision

[river98]

Hi All,

I am stuck in an R2A dilemma and appreciate any perspectives from you all ... Moved to India in 2008 soon after getting the green card 1 kid 7th grade usc...age 40. wife is a homemaker. I am working for a major mnc , supporting US clients ...late night calls, long hours and poor work -life balance. Sprialling expenses and almost ZERO savings considering all 'one time' expenses that seem to be popping out of everywhere... Didn't save much while in the US and whatever savings we had has shrunk thanks to wall street.

While overall, had a good time living in India, there are some things that are triggering R2A ideas.

Finding it hard to maintain GC since already got 2 REPs...don't think will get another extension ...even applying is a challenge since need to stay in the US till biometrics (6 weeks).

At a decision point whether to r2a ... even though job market seems to be dull, most of my colleagues in US and friends in IT are doing fairly well.

Other thoughts muddling my decision are aging parents, worsening infrastructure, poor quality of education in India compared to US (imho), cost of maintaining a basic lifestyle is ever increasing, salaries are not even lose to catching up, retaining GC.


Thank you for your inputs.

[Old-Spice2]

Hi All,

I am stuck in an R2A dilemma and appreciate any perspectives from you all ... Moved to India in 2008 soon after getting the green card 1 kid 7th grade usc...age 40. wife is a homemaker. I am working for a major mnc , supporting US clients ...late night calls, long hours and poor work -life balance. Sprialling expenses and almost ZERO savings considering all 'one time' expenses that seem to be popping out of everywhere... Didn't save much while in the US and whatever savings we had has shrunk thanks to wall street.

While overall, had a good time living in India, there are some things that are triggering R2A ideas.

Finding it hard to maintain GC since already got 2 REPs...don't think will get another extension ...even applying is a challenge since need to stay in the US till biometrics (6 weeks).

At a decision point whether to r2a ... even though job market seems to be dull, most of my colleagues in US and friends in IT are doing fairly well.

Other thoughts muddling my decision are aging parents, worsening infrastructure, poor quality of education in India compared to US (imho), cost of maintaining a basic lifestyle is ever increasing, salaries are not even lose to catching up, retaining GC.
Thank you for your inputs.

OP,

If you are not financially independent, you should not have gone back. Saving money in India is out of question unless you are a top exec or a businessman. For average person US is a better place. Now here are few points you need to consider before R2A:

- for your son it will be a one way journey. He is at an age that he will live in US forever if you r2a. You may be also forced to LIA forever to maintain contact with him. Not many kids turn out like Dr Nene.
- if you plan to LIA, make sure you can save up to $2M before you retire as climbing cost of healthcare and lower return on stocks may squeeze you
- include cost of college tuition, boarding and lodging to be around $200K. Either you fork out or ask your kid to take out loan. Then he will be burdened with a debt and unable to go for masters like many Americans.
- since you are single income family, try not to return to Bay Area. Go somewhere else.
- once you cross 50 holding on to your job in IT is difficult. You should be able to work till your son is ready to earn his daily bread.
- if you decide to LIA, make sure you have LTCI, nursing insurance and plethora of other insurances. Or be prepared to r2i if expenses start to climb. There are many people in this forum who r2i at 55 to avoid paying high medical insurance (up to $2K/m)
- don't think since US colleges are great your son will be a high achiever. There is a trend among new generation to pursue English, Arts and History here and complain about unemployment. Some even go on an Europe tour to find out what they want to do in life. And you can not do a squat if your son takes this path.

There is another solution. Keep your wife and kid in India and you R2A alone. If you have any close relatives, leave your son with them. You can save more $$, retain Indian-ness for your son and can one day r2i without any problem. Downside is you will have to live alone. Lakhs of Indians in Gulf do it. There is a price for both decision and only you can decide which one is good for you.

[RocknRoll]

Spiralling expenses and almost ZERO savings considering all 'one time' expenses that seem to be popping out of everywhere... Didn't save much while in the US and whatever savings we had has shrunk thanks to wall street.

Saving money in India is out of question unless you are a top exec or a businessman. For average person US is a better place. Now here are few points you need to consider before R2A:

Agree with most of what you have said OS2 but I have a different view regarding Savings.

I believe that Saving is a mind-set and discipline. Some have this discipline or cultivate it and they find a way to save some of their earnings irrespective of their salary. It is usually related to a life-style choice.
If someone was not able to save in the US and is not able to save in India, the chances are high they will not be able to save if they R2A unless they cultivate the discipline.

Sorry but thats how I see it. Individual circumstances could be different and I certainly don't mean to dis-respect or offend anyone here.

[vizagdesi]

OP,

Why not consider Gulf (Dubai) or Singapore? Still maintain Eastern culture while getting better standard of living?

[Imissindia]

Agree with most of what you have said OS2 but I have a different view regarding Savings.

I believe that Saving is a mind-set and discipline. Some have this discipline or cultivate it and they find a way to save some of their earnings irrespective of their salary. It is usually related to a life-style choice.
If someone was not able to save in the US and is not able to save in India, the chances are high they will not be able to save if they R2A unless they cultivate the discipline.

Sorry but thats how I see it. Individual circumstances could be different and I certainly don't mean to dis-respect or offend anyone here.

Completely agree. Many middle-class people from the older generation managed to accumulate savings on small (by today's standards) salaries. Even though they made a few thousand rupees per month, they lived within their means and did not cultivate excessive "needs".

[gurusw]

OS2, $2M savings before retirement? Is this savings w/o equity in the house you are talking about? or $2M net worth?
Just curious how this figure is calculated? or is it taken from some article?

[VS007]

India is expensive. Living < 50K even with your own house is a pipe dream even in a tier 3 city, or you have to vastly downgrade your life style.

[Old-Spice2]

OS2, $2M savings before retirement? Is this savings w/o equity in the house you are talking about? or $2M net worth?
Just curious how this figure is calculated? or is it taken from some article?

Total net worth. Assumption 500K equity in home and 1.5M in investment. With 4% withdrawal rate, you can take out $60K/year and pay taxes on it. You will be left with approx $50K per year for spending. You need that much to live comfortably in US. Most of the retirement articles talk about this number. Do you think it is on the higher side? I can give 10% discount for you:)

Remember due to clean air and hygienic condition, people in US live longer which means you need more money. Expenses grow faster as you grow older, mostly due to medical and personal care cost.

[okonomi]

OP,
If you are not financially independent, you should not have gone back. ..
- once you cross 50 holding on to your job in IT is difficult. You should be able to work till your son is ready to earn his daily bread.
- if you decide to LIA, make sure you have LTCI, nursing insurance and plethora of other insurances. Or be prepared to r2i if expenses start to climb. There are many people in this forum who r2i at 55 to avoid paying high medical insurance (up to $2K/m)...

OP was 40 in the year 2008.... and in the IT field. The post #2 contends that it is hard to work in the InfoTech field once a person is >50. This leaves hardly any time in between R2A and end of career to accumulate the nest-egg for retirement.
Is the situation really that tough ? Or is it a case (as in #3 and 5) of savings-challenged family ? Not being able to save money is a common situation in the USofA. http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2007/10/08/10-ways-to-build-the-habit-of-saving-money/

http://www.indiatogether.org/health/infofiles/life.htm
(Table in four columns; Life Expectancy in India)
===========================================
STATE TOTAL MALE FEMALE


Andhra Pradesh 63.1 61.6 64.1
Assam 57.2 57.1 57.6
Bihar 60.2 60.7 58.9
Gujarat 62.8 61.9 63.7
Haryana 64.5 64.1 65.0
Himachal Pradesh 65.6 65.1 65.8
Karnataka 64.0 62.4 65.5
Kerala 73.5 70.6 76.1
Madhya Pradesh 56.4 56.5 56.2
Maharastra 65.8 64.5 67.0
Orissa 57.7 57.6 57.8
Punjab 68.1 66.9 69.1
Rajastan 60.5 59.8 60.9
Tamilnadu 64.6 63.7 65.7
Uttar Pradesh 58.4 58.9 57.7
West Bengal 63.4 62.8 64.3
India 61.7 60.8 62.5
===========================================
Note: Numbers are pro'lly skewed downward by the majority of desis with hardscrabble lives. Must be much better for those with education, computers and access to internet.

[MrLong]

Total net worth. Assumption 500K equity in home and 1.5M in investment. With 4% withdrawal rate, you can take out $60K/year and pay taxes on it. You will be left with approx $50K per year for spending. You need that much to live comfortably in US. Most of the retirement articles talk about this number. Do you think it is on the higher side? I can give 10% discount for you:)

Remember due to clean air and hygienic condition, people in US live longer which means you need more money. Expenses grow faster as you grow older, mostly due to medical and personal care cost.

@ 60 K per annum and a SFH house - LIA will also be a pain if you factor in Property taxes, especially in North East. A normal SFH taxes runs about $15 K today and keeps increasing every year at a much higher rate than inflation.