To Go India or Not - Not a typical dilemma

ukdesi · Post by **ukdesi** » Thu Oct 04, 2012 9:57 pm

Hi guys,

I just stumbled upon this forum on fine day and since then I am addicted to it. I have read a lot of threads and it'a amazing how much our thoughts, ideas, frustrations etc match. I think it's a common bond that all NRI's share. Anyway, I would just come to the point now.

Just to set the expectations right, bit of info on me. Typical s/w engineer from Mumbai. Worked with an MNC in Mumbai for a year, got the opportunity to come to the UK. Filed for HSMP, then Tier 1, found a job in London. Have been working for an insurance firm for past 4 year. Decent role. Managing about 12 people including a 4 man off shore team. Considering, I am only 29 some people might think I am a bit inexperienced for this role. And maybe I am. But I have a very bold outgoing persoanlity and excellent communication skills. SO that helps and I am usually good with people. So far, have had no major issues with the team. Got married a few years ago. Have two sons. Now the immigration scenario:

Me: Have PR (Indefinite Leave to Remain) , soon to be naturalized
Wife: Indian passport (No UK visa)
Sons: Indian passport (No UK visa)

My wife was with me as a Tier 1 dependent. We decided to have our sons delivered in India as we felt more comfortable with our family being around. Wifey went India for delivery and hasn't come to the UK since then. I have been lucky enough to make 20 day visits every 3 months. So as of now, she has no UK visa. Now starts my dilemma:-

I can summarize my confusion as follows:,
Do I go back now and setlle in India (R2I)
Or
Should I bring them over, live here for 7 more years (till my sons and wife are UK citizens?) Basically, Is UK citizenship gonna benefit them in the future?

Now if I elaborate on the two options:
Option 1:
My current company has no branch in India. So I will have to work in some MNC or do something on my own. (not sure what though). I would love to be a self employed contractor, working as a consultant. But for some reason, this model hasn't really taken off in India. My choice of city in India will have to be Kochi, as it is my native and we have invested in a house over there already. Dad has retired and is living in this property. Kochi further limits my options, as there are not many IT companies over there. Personally, I don't mind Kochi. I think standard of living is better than Mumbai. Debatable, but it's just personal preference. Don't want to start a debate on this :P

Option 2:
Apply for spouse's and son's dependent visa and get them over to UK. Expense for their citizenship will be as below:

2.5 yr visa: 2 grand
2.5 yr extension: 2 grand
ILR: 2 grand
Citizenship: 2 grand

7 years later and 8 grand down(based on current visa fees), they will be UK citizens. Missus says she wants to raise kids in India (basically move back when they are 6-7 yrs age). She beleives UK will not be good for their up bringing.

So my confusion is, if we have to move to India later, why all the hassle to come here in the first place. Isn't option 1 better?

Dicky_Bird · Post by **Dicky_Bird** » Fri Oct 05, 2012 1:45 am

its again a difficult situation and there is no right or wrong answer.
of you have enough financial cusion you cannot back to India a d settle in your native place.
I am sure you are missing your kids,wife and family as you are already staying away from them,
these are wonderful years when your kids will go thru many changes and you may miss these times after few years
Your decision needs to come from your heart and not mind,
I would have listened to what my wife wanted:))

Philosopher · Post by **Philosopher** » Fri Oct 05, 2012 9:25 pm

Does your wife work in India and what age are your sons? If your family comes over, is your wife planning to work here?

I would say bring them over and stay put for some more years till your kids are 7-10. If you had applied for their visa before July this year you would have got your wife's ILR in 2 years and citizenship in one more year. I guess you can still get citizenship for your kids with your citizenship since I don't think there is a time-stay requirement for minors. The expense is not much(relatively) and will be easily recovered by your stay here.

Either way, it is always better to stay with your family.

sumachechi · Post by **sumachechi** » Sat Oct 06, 2012 7:10 am

If you are planning to return to India when your kids are in primary school, not really sure what the UK citizenship will help them with. IT will allow them easy travelling options around the world.
University as local grads in UK universities(paying local grad fees) is based on domicile and not on citizenship- so if you are away from uk 3 years prior to application, they will have to apply as foreign students anyway.
Plus the situation for OCI residents in India and applicability for many national universities for admission in genenral quota ( not NRI quota) is not clear yet.

ukdesi · Post by **ukdesi** » Mon Oct 08, 2012 1:59 pm

Dicky_Bird;476168its again a difficult situation and there is no right or wrong answer.
of you have enough financial cusion you cannot back to India a d settle in your native place.
I am sure you are missing your kids,wife and family as you are already staying away from them,
these are wonderful years when your kids will go thru many changes and you may miss these times after few years
Your decision needs to come from your heart and not mind,
I would have listened to what my wife wanted:))

I know. It's such a difficult choice. We (Me and wife) both are not able to decide. Yes. I certainly do want to be with my family. Don't want to miss my boys' growing years.
To be honest, there is not much financial cushion. Dad didn't retire with a plan or everything. It kind of explains his life. Never had a plan. I think he sometimes regrets retiring. He is only 59. I think he is feeling bad asking me for money every time. I usually try and give my mum before they need.

Financial cushion wise, I have assets of around 1.2 cr. That includes the house we live in. No investments in the UK.

ukdesi · Post by **ukdesi** » Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:08 pm

Philosopher;476219Does your wife work in India and what age are your sons? If your family comes over, is your wife planning to work here?

I would say bring them over and stay put for some more years till your kids are 7-10. If you had applied for their visa before July this year you would have got your wife's ILR in 2 years and citizenship in one more year. I guess you can still get citizenship for your kids with your citizenship since I don't think there is a time-stay requirement for minors. The expense is not much(relatively) and will be easily recovered by your stay here.

Either way, it is always better to stay with your family.

No, my wife doesn't work. She isn't very well qualified. Quite a traditional girl. And she is not planning to work anytime soon.

Boys are about 7 months old. If family comes over, wife is not planning to work.

Yes. I could have applied for the visa before July. But my wife was going through her post delivery phase and she was in no mood to give her IELTS and all that they need now for dependent visa.

That is interesting. I didn't know that minors don't have a time stay requirement. Are you saying, we can apply for their citizenship as soon as they are in the UK. Wife will still be on dependent visa, not even ILR. Will they allow registration for the minors? Is there anything you can help me with mate? link or websites?

Expense will be covered by my salary. But it's not as much as some of you guys earn.. :). So, when I do my budget, we will only get by. End of seven years, we will be exactly where we started. (savings wise). And thats why I am thinking, is it worth it?

If we are exactly where we are (apart from boys getting UK citizenship), then why not live in India and enjoy with all family and friends? This is because missus is strictly against sending boys to secondary school here.

ukdesi · Post by **ukdesi** » Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:13 pm

sumachechi;476270If you are planning to return to India when your kids are in primary school, not really sure what the UK citizenship will help them with. IT will allow them easy travelling options around the world.
University as local grads in UK universities(paying local grad fees) is based on domicile and not on citizenship- so if you are away from uk 3 years prior to application, they will have to apply as foreign students anyway.
Plus the situation for OCI residents in India and applicability for many national universities for admission in genenral quota ( not NRI quota) is not clear yet.

Thanks for the info. I didn't know, UK uni fees were based on domicile. That means, kids could be in a worse position. Can't go to UK uni's coz they aren't domiciled here. And not in India, coz OCI rules are not clear. Thats a double whammy?

So what are other members who R2I'ed planning? I have read that quite a few of you have USC and your kids. What happens to all these kids with OCI? Surely , it should be on domicile.

mobi · Post by **mobi** » Mon Oct 08, 2012 8:51 pm

If you become UK citizen, then your children can apply for British citizenship anytime. Your wife can apply for BC too once she has spent 3 years in UK.

If your children become British, they can re-apply for Indian citizenship until they are 18 years of age (and if they want to become Indian again they will have to give up other citizenship).

direstraits88 · Post by **direstraits88** » Mon Oct 08, 2012 9:27 pm

You need to look at the next 5-7 years before your kids start going to school. Do and your wife want to live in UK or India? If both are inclined to live in India, this may be time to do so.

If you move to India and things don't work out, will you be ok to move back to UK?

You are looking at this strictly from a monetary perspective and no one knows the future. If you need to also support your parents monetarily, it can a tricky situation living together. You need to consider your wife's relationship with your parents particularly when she's a stay at home Mom.

If you were to move back to India, you may need to move to Bangalore/Hyd/Chennai from a career perspective. You may find a IT job in Cochin but you may not have many career choices in terms of progression.

ukdesi · Post by **ukdesi** » Mon Oct 08, 2012 10:33 pm

Thanks for your reply.

We (DW and me) both are agreed on raising kids in India, once they are 8 - 9 years of age. We don't feel the UK environment is good for them when they are in the important phase of their lives (between 10 - 18).

I think I will have to be OK with moving back to UK, if things don't work out. I don't mind life in UK, apart from weather. :(

Yes. Correct. Completely agree. Future is totally unknown. But have to plan something monetarily. Living together is tricky. More so for me :p. My dad can get me really annoyed at times and vice versa. Mum is totally cool, with her as well. Touchwood. Absolutely no DIL - MIL issues yet.

I keep telling my wife the same. Re-location might be needed. She is totally against it. Her view is, if we have to re-locate , we might as well live in London. Personally, I like living in North Indian cities. Mumbai, will be my first preference, as I have lived their for 21 years and have lots of friends and family. But then, even Mumbai is not so great for IT. Pune is a better choice I've heard.

Anyone know of IT contracting in India? Can you actually work as a contractor in IT services industry?