How much is enough ? - 2008 discussion

[RRK]

This is one of the hot topic being discussed in any of the parties, informal get together, meetings and ofcourse in our online forum.

The simple and easy answer is "It Depends !".

But no one is satisfied with that, because every one knows that, even before asking the question.

We have got various answers from 100K to 640K and some wild numbers like million $.

So, let us put some assumptions and work out the numbers.

Let us start with basics.
1) Let us assume an unmarried boy/girl came to US to work for some time and planning to go back as single. This person will return back to work in India.
We dont want this guy to seek handouts from friends and relatives for his return and will give a target to save.

Flight ticket - one way $1K/person
Ship goods - $2-$5K
Immediate settlement expenses.
- buy a car, house rent/advance, appliances etc ($15-$25K)
- living expenses in India for Short Term ( $5-$10K)

Total = $23K to $41K

2) Let us assume a family of 3 returning back.
Flight ticket - one way $1K/person = $3K
Ship goods - $2-$5K
Immediate settlement expenses.
- buy a car, house rent/advance, appliances etc ($15-$25K)
- living expenses in India for Short Term ( $5-$10K)
- toys, clothes, kitchen utensils, furnitures, house wares $5K-$20K

Total = $35K to $63K

3) Some argue if you can't buy a house after return, what is the point of going to US ? This is generally accepted argument by most of us. We dont question the logic behind it. It is so obvious why question this ?

But the ground reality is very much different. It is easier to buy a house in US, ( cheaper, easy money available, long term loans available) compared to any of the metro. First you have to downsize, second you will pay more price for lower standard of living.

Ask yourself, what will happen,
1) if you return w/o money to buy a house? Will the sky fall ?
2) Can't you earn enough to pay for a home mortgage after your return ? If not you have other serious problems, and r2i is not an issue at all for you.

3) What is the difference between renting and paying mortgage to the bank ?

I am not saying one should not save for home. But dont put pressure on yourself, by including that as a "MUST GOAL".


4) Additional goals:

Some of you plan to save some moeny towards child education, your own retirement, buy a secondary house in hill station etc.

Obviously this needs some time to learn the individual's situation, returning city, cost of living of the city, inflation, number of children and their age, and so many other factors.

Factors affecting the target amount calculations:

1) Few want to return at the age of 40, retired. I would say this is just a fashion statement. This fashion will fade very quickly.

2) Few plan to return for semi retirement. It means they are neither retired nor working. A form of useless state. They are young and can't explain to any one why they are not going to work, when their father is working.

3) India is status conscious society, whether you like it or not, you have to accept it. What you do, where you live, what you wear, what you drive, where you eat all matters. Every one wants to know about it. Don't ignore this in your target calculations. There is a general feeling here, if some one return, it is because he made lot of money or he is a failure, could not find a right job in USA. This very much affects your lifestyle and also related expenses. Include this factor in your savings calculations.

4) If you artifically set a very high limit, beyond your reach, you will need more time to work and save before return. This has directly opposite effect on your return plans.

The longer you stay, you are risking the possibility of not returning. ( kids grow up, parents in haven, no friends in India, difficulty to adjust to a living conditions of a third world country )

Eventually you are left with your target money minus your r2i goal. You will screw up your own plans.

Good luck ! :)

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A Poll has been created to reflect the thoughts of current members.

Instead of asking just how much is enough, we tried to capture additional background information of the voter, so the data can be interpreted correctly.

The Q&A has been designed to capture data from the prospective r2ier who are in planning stage and also those who already returned to India. You can't ignore the later group from the survey.

The questions are split into two pages. First page is about the current status, second is about the r2i plan.

Our tests showed the entire survey can be completed in 2-3 minutes. Please be honest and make the survey results meaningful.

The survey results will not be published when the survey is in progress to reduce the influence of the polled votes. Once the survey is completed, all data will be shared with members.

http://www.r2iclubforums.com/esp/public/survey.php?name=How_much_is_enough

You may invite your friends and relatives to participate in the survey.
Pls send the link to as many people as you know. This incudes those you know who has returned.

No login required. One need not be a member in r2iclub to participate in the survey.

Your response to this survey is totally anonymous. Your privacy is secure. None of your personal information is recorded. None of the data can be tracked to any one individual. The survey result will show only aggregate information.

Be candid and only join the poll if you think you can help the community and help yourself. Dont lie because that will make the poll unuseful for every one and it is waste of time for you and every one.

added later:
Your Privacy is fully protected. Poll data will never be sold and will be made available to this r2i community only.

added on Feb 6,2008:
Poll results updated:
http://www.r2iclub.com/gen/poll_how_...gh_for_r2i.htm

[RRK]

Does R2I in your poll context mean Return to India or Retire to India?
If latter, some of us (including me) are not inclined to participate in this poll.

Also, I feel the poll is asking too many personal questions. Just my opinion.[/quote]


1. It is return to India and not retire to India. Check Page-2.

2. What are the personal questions ? Pls explain.

[KRV]

RRK, picket and others who contributed to the new poll,

Great job! Hopefully a lot of people (thousands would be nice!) take this poll sincerely so that we can get meaningful segmented data.

[RRK]

So far we have 17 responses. A cursory look shows that members have taken it seriously and voted. Thanks a lot to every one.

KRV, Picket, Without you guys, we would not be having this poll. I only helped to extend the poll to cover r2ied members and add few questions to capture data to make the interpretation meaningful.

Because generally the bigger the family size, bigger the target. Also the current income level influence a lot about monthly expenses later and thus the target size.

So, I dont see any question that is irrelevant to the poll. We can always improve the poll. I welcome suggestions.

Just a comment about opinion expressed about personal nature of questions.

If I sit with you and ask you how much you earn, it is personal.
If hundred people type in a paper their annual income and drop it in a box and mix the papers. There is nothing personal. We may take all the papers and separate them into class A, B, C etc., No one will be able to identify the income of MNR2I or RRK from the box of papers.

There is not even a way to know who voted and who not. So, where is the issue ?

disclosure: I have voted.

[DosaiLvr]

RRK,

For survey question #11, Immigration Status at the time of Return

Is it too late to provide - Foreign citizenship - no OCI/PIO as an option

I fall in that category as would a few others I'd guess...

[RRK]

MNR2I,

You have right not to vote. It is your wish.

You dont even need to mention that you skipped the poll. If you dont want to express the reasons it is fine too.

However, if you have any specific concern, we can discuss.

[RRK]

Sneak Preview of the poll.

Total respondents :82 so far and counting
82% USA
51% live in own house
5 of them have 2M$-5M$ networth
Only one returning with >4 family members
Majority return after 9-12 years
Return age is between 36-40
Majority prefer to return with 1C-2C
7 non r2iclub members
1 of them said they wont recommend r2iclub to any one... :(

[VS007]

How will this poll help answer this question?

[RRK]

How will this poll help answer this question?[/quote]

VS007,
The background for the poll is here:

Develop new poll for "how much is enough" thread?

[cyberabadi]

RRK/Picket & Others,

What exactly do you mean by the statement in Q.14. Does it mean "Future Savings" from today (or) is it "Total Savings" from FOB. Also, if its 'Total Savings', do we take their current value. Consider few who move their saving at regular intervals and some wait till their boarding call.

I had voted yesterday taking 'Future Savings' from today before R2I as the intended Q..


[quote]
Q.14. Your target savings before R2I? ( exclude house/apartment costs ) - in Indian Rupees. Convert your savings to Indian Rupees, even if you dont plan to move all your assets to India. 1US$ = 40Rs. Be realistic, Please.
[/quote]