Are Indian cities and states friendly to visitors and outsiders ?

[Ambhi]

Do some Indian cities give a hard time to visitors ?

Are some cities too Conservative ?

Is it tough to survive in some cities and states like Chennai and Tamilnadu without knowing the local languages spoken ?

[Desi]

If Cosmopolitan involves not damaging public and private properties, pelting stones and burning tires when political events occur then it is Cosmopolitan.

Pelting stones, etc is hooliganism and not not being cosmopolitan.

If Cosmopolitan involves having the culture that fosters talent that wins Oscars and Grammies then it is Cosmopolitan.

Fostering talent that receives recognition elsewhere is not a benchmark of being or not being cosmopolitan.

If Cosmopolitan involves having some of the best beaches and beach resorts in the country then it is Cosmopolitan.

Geography does not equate to being or not being cosmopolitan.

I could take more of your points and point similar incongruency with what those points are trying to defend.

I am not suggesting whether Chennai is cosmopolitan or not, I am just pointing out that in your desire to defend the points you took are incongruent to that you are trying to defend. It kinda shows some nerve being touched.

If the image of Chennai comes from just a perception of Cosmopolitan based on ability to people to converse in Hindi *alone* then only that perception which is nothing but a product of judgmental prejudice needs repair not the place.

I agree, but am not sure if that is what member K11 was saying.

[dbs]

If people want to talk in Hindi, sure they can but it is a bit much to expect locals to converse in Hindi. Try doing that in the Windy City.

Tamil Nadu should not be asked to cater to the minorities, if they wish to of course no one can stop them. I am sure there are a few french people in tamil or spanish, and so all the sign boards should be in all the languages spoken in UNO. In fact even in UN, they do not have signboards in all those languages.

In 70s, I often used to travel to Madras (that was its name those days) and I had no problem. Only once, a friend and I decided to go for a movie after a meal at a restaurant. We got hold of a three wheeler, who sort of indicated that he was not prepared to go. I got my notebook out and began to write his number down. He indicated for us to sit in the vehicle and took us to a police station. As I (with a tie on) wishing to assert myself started addressing the policeman, he asked me to let him listen to the driver. After listening to him, he told us that the driver has to go elsewhere but he was willing to get us anther scooter but was unable to make us understand. Yes, if knew English or Hindi, he could have but if we were Russians, his goose was cooked.

I am sure Tamils are very Tamiz and would go miles to accomodate outsiders but if the outsiders consider that it is their birthright to impose themselves on locals, that would put their back up and mine as well.

As for renaming, I agree that most local politicians did diddly little for locals to deserve it but neither did St. George or st thomas, I do wonder who was Marina or Elliot or Ripon, and was Victoria a bar maid at the local bar and helped serve liquor to locals.
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It doesn't matter if the glass is half full or empty, clearly there is room for more wine.

[Memento Vivere]

Tamilians who grow up in states other than Tamil Nadu are very different from Tamilians who grow up in Tamil Nadu.

The difference is not so stark in cases of people from other states. Their being out of their state during the growing up years does not make so much difference.

In an average office environment in an average MNC, if a group is having lunch, and 5 are Tamilians, it is not so hard to figure out which of the 5 moved out of TN for KG, +2, bachelor's degree, and which left it first time for a job.

In an average IIT or REC boys hostel.... never mind...

P.S. Thread is banter, and data very anecdotal. Peace! :emrose:

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I was positive i posted in banter thread! Maybe posts got moved after that! Leaving as is.....

[Ambhi]

Longtime valuable member like IBD loses his cool over some remarks by an unknown member shows cultural and language issues are not easy to let go. Hope he is allowed to post even now and hope he realizes the folly of losing his cool. It's not worth it. I also feel we had several such debates in the past but I don't think they helped change anyone's pre- conceived notions , instead we lost valuable members' participation.

RRS I am sure you would agree every major topic discussed in the forum is definitely sensitive to some group of people. Narendra Modi is a sensitive topic to some, Congress is a sensitive topic to some, BJP to some, even Mahatma Gandhi related threads have had some hot discussions. Is every topic worth it ? I don't know as it is usually very difficult to quantify benefits that members derive from every thread. Nevertheless "It's not worth it to discuss such topics" is an individual opinion but it cannot be a determination that one can make on behalf of rest of the forum.

If some members are being sensitive and as a result they do not participate there is nothing much others could do. So suggesting that the onus is on others not to discuss topics that will make those members upset is like saying don't eat eggs in front of vegetarians as they would get mad. The onus is on every member to exercise restraint on self and not react in a way that defies forum rules. The onus is not on the other members to stop posting opinions on sensitive topics or otherwise in a public forum like this within the scope of what is allowed to be discussed in a thread. New or old or unknown all members are valuable to the forum the moment they begin to post.

[okonomi]

annotation = our people in the quote below are Americans.
[QUOTE]Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime." - Mark Twain

[k11]

Dividing the states based on regional languages was done hastily without giving due consideration on what should be the guidelines for migrant population, should job seekers learn the local language, should promotions in state govt. jobs be based on local language proficiency as it is now in many states. These are highly difficult and divisive questions and the division of states happening shortly within few years of independence did not help.

Learning local language should be done on one's own volition and should not be forced. Scientists have found that learning new language is extremely difficult once kids reach 18+. That's when most leave their home towns for jobs/education.

Linguistic passion is unfortunate for people like me who studied in one state, worked in another state and relatives now live in totally new state. People like me know multiple languages but no state's localites embrace people like me as truly one of their own.

Good points.

Problem is in India, sections of people take ownership of a city.
We speak XX language and from XX state, this is our city, you need to speak XX language to live here or to work, etc.

Cosmopolitan - A city/place or person that embraces its multicultural demographics.

A Cosmopolitan city does not mean rejection of one or many languages/people. It merely includes accomodation of the languages and people.

For a city to become truly comopolitan, first thing to do is get the politicos off the city, seperate goveranance or a two tier system, where the city should have more freedom to adopt its own policies suitable to its own people. Cities have people from different regions, more diverse so it should have its own educational policy, and other policies.

Mumbai's population might be different from rest of Maharashtra.
Chennai's from TN, Kolkata's from WB.

I do think the Govts need not make any changes to entire state, just relax and modify certain policy just for the bigger city.

Similarly just for the migrants in one city, rest of the state need not make large scale changes.
No reason why Hindi, Telugu, Malayalam should be taught in govt schools in Trichy because of huge N Indian or AP or KL population in Chennai, or Tamil in Aurangabad when there are Tamil population is in Mumbai.

I am also open to the idea of making all the metros UT just like Delhi. But of course that will have a bigger backlash from politcos, recently one of the celebs got hounded when she tweeted Mumbai should be seperated from MH.

Categorizing City and the State in the same bucket does not make sense.

[okonomi]

A stranger not feeling welcome is like a woman not feeling physically secure.
One can argue and rationalize specifics till cows come home. But nevertheless it’s a very palpable feeling that can’t be reasoned with by “why” and “Oh it shouldn’t be that way” and “oh look in other places this or that happens but…”
Reasoning, arguing and trying to prove the counter-point doesn’t do a diddly squat about that feeling....that everyone here has acutely felt sometime or other.
Just like places where women feel secure says a lot about those places, same way strangers feeling welcome, says a lot too.
I thought I would just put that out here.

Did not India come up 4th in the ranking of the most dangerous country for women ? Given that, what is the difference between one place within India and another ? It is a tough place, and folks who take the risk (know the why's and wherefore's..&) have to muddle through it. As Tiny Tim might add," .... god bless us, every one".